For the Animals
An Argument Guide
PT

Home / E. Relativism, freedom and evasions / Part DIR

E4

"The state can't ban what I eat."

The answer in one sentence

the argument changes the question. The debate was "is eating animals wrong?", and it becomes "should the state ban it?". They're different questions: many wrong things aren't banned, and the answer to the second doesn't answer the first. Besides, the state already regulates what we eat, and the liberal harm principle, which protects individual freedom, was formulated precisely for cases where there's no victim.

Short answer

No one here is talking about arresting meat eaters. The question was whether it's right, not whether it should be banned. Many wrong things aren't banned, like lying to a friend. And the state already regulates what we eat: there are banned foods, health rules and laws against animal cruelty. The liberal principle that protects freedom, the harm principle, applies to choices that don't harm others, and animals are those others.

For children

Some things aren't against the law but still aren't nice to do, like lying to a friend. The question "is it forbidden?" is different from "is it right?". When we talk about animals, the first question is whether it's right to hurt them. Whether the law should change is another conversation.

Ask a question back

"Leaving the law aside: do you think it's right to make an animal suffer when there's an alternative?"

Como pode aparecer

"Vegans want to ban meat."
Everyday conversation
"Vegan dictatorship."
Everyday conversation
"The state doesn't get to run my plate."
Everyday conversation
"First the straws, then the barbecue."
Social media
"Policies against meat are food authoritarianism."
Political version
"It's my personal choice; don't impose your morals." (which is E1)
Disguised version

The strongest version

How it is said

"Vegans want to ban meat. Vegan dictatorship. The state doesn't get to run my plate."

Strongest version (steelman):

  1. P1In a free society, the state shouldn't interfere with personal choices that don't harm other people.
  2. P2What each person eats is a personal choice.
  3. CSo the state can't ban eating meat.

P1 is a version of John Stuart Mill's harm principle, a pillar of liberalism. The problem lies in P2: eating meat affects animals and, in several ways, other people. And even if the conclusion were accepted, it wouldn't answer whether eating meat is morally right.

The argument is valid. Its soundness fails at P2, and the argument answers a different question from the one being debated.

Full answer

  1. a

    Reconstruction and diagnosis

    The argument swaps one question for another:

    QuestionTypeExample of an answer
    Is eating animals wrong?MoralThe subject of this guide
    Should the state ban it?Political and legalDepends on many factors: feasibility, transition, consensus

    Answering "no" to the second doesn't answer the first. Many animal advocates don't even call for bans, but for voluntary change, subsidies and gradual transitions.

  2. b

    Where the argument breaks

    1. It changes the subject.

    The moral debate doesn't depend on the legal one. Lying, cheating or being cruel with words are often legal and wrong.

    2. The state already regulates food.

    There are health bans, labeling rules, bans on eating certain animals, such as protected wild species, and laws against animal cruelty (D7). The idea that one's plate is untouchable doesn't describe reality.

    3. The harm principle favors animals.

    Mill argued that individual freedom may only be limited to prevent harm to others. The argument assumes eating meat harms no one, but the animals are harmed, and there are also effects on the climate, public health and the emergence of diseases (family H).

    4. "Vegan dictatorship" is a straw man.

    It attributes to vegans a proposal for an immediate ban that many don't support, and answers that instead of the moral argument. And even for those who do call for laws, the moral question comes first.

    5. Protections have always limited freedoms.

    Laws against cruelty to dogs limit what owners may do. No one calls that a dictatorship.

  3. c

    Data and sources

    SourceWhat it saysNote
    Mill, *On Liberty* (1859)Individual freedom may only be limited to prevent harm to othersAlso used in E1
    UK Animal Welfare Act 2006Makes causing unnecessary suffering to a protected animal an offenceThe state already limits what can be done with animals
  4. d

    The strongest counter-reply: change should be voluntary

    The most serious version grants that eating animals may be wrong, but says change should come from individual conscience, not the force of the state, because bans breed resistance and black markets.

  5. e

    Why the counter-reply doesn't reach the conclusion

    It accepts the moral question.

    If change should be voluntary, it should happen, and it's up to each person to make it.

    It's a discussion of strategy, not justification.

    One can debate the best means without denying the end.

    Voluntary isn't neutral.

    States today subsidize animal farming; removing subsidies isn't banning anything.

Reasoning errors

Logical

Is the form valid?

Changing the subject
From "is it wrong?" to "should it be banned?"
Straw man
Attributes to vegans a proposal for an immediate ban

Epistemological

Does the evidence support it?

Not knowing how food is regulated
Ignores that the state already regulates food

Moral

Is the criterion coherent?

Freedom without a victim
Applies the harm principle while ignoring who is harmed

Biases

Psychological reactance

Feeling one's freedom threatened breeds resistance to the message

General literature on reactance

Motivated reasoning

Changing the question avoids the uncomfortable one

General literature on motivated cognition

Extrapolations

The principle being tested is: "the state can't interfere with what I do with my money and time, even if there's a victim".

If it applied to…DogfightingTap to see

It couldn't be banned

It's a crime

If it applied to…Buying protected wild animalsTap to see

It would be free

It's a crime

If it applied to…Child laborTap to see

The state couldn't ban those who hire children

No one accepts this

Contradictions

Supports laws against cruelty to dogs.

Which limit owners' freedom.

Accepts health rules.

Which limit what can be sold and eaten.

Doesn't think everything legal is right.

The moral question remains open.

What the argument gets right

What is true

Concern for individual freedom is legitimate, and authoritarianism is a real risk. Ill-conceived bans can be unjust and ineffective, and cultural change tends to last longer when it's voluntary.

But

But the question "should it be banned?" doesn't replace "is it right?". Even those who defend total freedom of choice have to decide what they will choose.

Connections

Usually comes before

E1 It's my personal choice; don't impose your morals.Swaps the moral question for the legal one
D7 It's legal; the law allows it.Says the state can't ban it
E4this argument

Usually comes after

References