Home / L. Attacks on veganism and vegans / Part IND
"Vegans are all hippies"
it's a stereotype, and even if it were true it wouldn't answer anything. What happens to animals doesn't depend on the lifestyle, clothes or politics of those who defend them. Vegans are a varied group, and research shows that prejudice against them is real and strong. Labeling someone a hippie is a way of not discussing the argument.
Short answer
There are vegans of every kind: athletes, doctors, business owners, people on the right and on the left. But even if they were all hippies, the pig would still feel pain just the same. The style of the speaker doesn't change whether the argument is right. Labeling someone is a way of not discussing what they said.
For children
Imagine someone said: "I won't listen to you because you wear a colorful T-shirt." Does that make sense? The T-shirt doesn't change whether what you said is right or wrong. It's the same with vegans: how the people who defend animals dress or live doesn't change the fact that animals feel pain.
"If the same idea were said by someone in a suit, would it become more correct?"
Como pode aparecer
"Vegans are all hippies."
"Tree-huggers, granola types, peace and love."
"A hippie dream." (which is J15)
"Go hug a tree."
"Are you also anti-vaccine and living on incense?"
"Veganism is a cult, a religion." (which is L2)
The strongest version
"Vegans are all hippies, living on incense and peace and love. You can't take them seriously."
Strongest version (steelman):
- P1Veganism is associated with a counterculture holding unrealistic ideas about society.
- P2Ideas coming from unrealistic groups tend to be unreliable.
- CSo vegans' conclusions about animals don't deserve to be taken seriously.
P1 has a historical origin: natural food movements and the counterculture of the 1960s and 1970s helped spread vegetarianism. But animal ethics has other roots, and veganism today is far more varied. The bigger problem lies in P2, which judges the idea by the image of those who hold it.
The argument is invalid: it's an attack on the person (ad hominem), not on the argument.
Full answer
- a
Reconstruction and diagnosis
The argument swaps the question about the idea for a question about who holds it:
Question About what Relevant to the animals? What are vegans like? Lifestyle, appearance, politics No Do animals suffer from exploitation? Facts about the animals Yes Is it just to cause that suffering for a taste? Ethics Yes - b
Where the argument breaks
1. It's ad hominem.
Judging an idea by the image of those who hold it is a classic error. An animal's pain doesn't depend on anyone's haircut.
2. It's a stereotype.
Vegans are found in every profession, income bracket and political position. The image of the "hippie" describes, at most, a part of a part.
3. The prejudice is real and documented.
Research shows that vegans and vegetarians are the target of negative attitudes equal to or greater than those directed at several other groups. The hippie label is one way of expressing that prejudice.
4. Animal ethics has academic foundations.
The central argument of veganism comes from moral philosophy, discussed in universities by authors from different schools, not from a countercultural aesthetic.
5. Even hippies can be right.
That a group has wrong ideas on some subjects doesn't show it's wrong on all of them. Each claim has to be assessed on what it says.
- c
Data and sources
Source What it says Note MacInnis and Hodson, 2017 Omnivores evaluated vegetarians and vegans equally or more negatively than several common prejudice target groups; vegans were evaluated more negatively than vegetarians Group Processes & Intergroup Relations, 20(6) Minson and Monin, 2012 Meat eaters tend to disparage vegetarians because they expect to be judged by them Social Psychological and Personality Science, 3(2) - d
The strongest counter-reply: the lifestyle puts people off
The most serious version says: even if the label is unfair, the hippie image makes veganism less attractive, and that harms the cause. It would be better for vegans to look more "normal".
- e
Why the counter-reply doesn't reach the conclusion
It's a question of communication, not of truth.
It can be useful to think about how the message lands, but that doesn't change whether the message is right (K6).
The image no longer matches reality.
There are vegans of every profile, and showing that works better than asking everyone to fit one mold.
Whoever uses the label isn't assessing the argument.
The objection serves to end the conversation, not to improve communication.
- f
Back to the moral question
Even if every vegan were a hippie, the question would remain the same: is it just to make animals suffer and die for the pleasure of taste? The answer doesn't depend on who asks it.
Reasoning errors
Logical
Is the form valid?
Ad hominem
Hasty generalization
Epistemological
Does the evidence support it?
Stereotype
Moral
Is the criterion coherent?
Changing the subject
Biases
Do-gooder derogation
Ridiculing those with a moral stance eases the feeling of being judged
In-group bias
The out-group is seen as homogeneous
Literature on out-group homogeneity
Extrapolations
The principle being tested is: "an idea held by people with a certain lifestyle doesn't deserve to be taken seriously".
If it applied to…Civil rightsTap to see
Causes championed by long-haired students in the 1960s would be dismissible
Many of them are now consensus
If it applied to…ScienceTap to see
A discovery made by an eccentric would be false
The history of science shows otherwise
If it applied to…Any causeTap to see
Labeling its advocates would be enough to refute it
No one accepts this for their own causes
Contradictions
No one rejects medicine because a doctor has long hair.
The stereotype doesn't describe even the people the person knows.
But uses one against vegans.
What the argument gets right
What is true
It's right that veganism has historical roots intersecting with the counterculture, and that a movement's public image affects how its ideas are received. Thinking about communication is legitimate.
But
But the image of those who hold an idea doesn't decide whether it's true. Animals feel pain whoever says so.
Connections
Usually comes before
Usually comes after